<html><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; ">Gabriele is totally right. Let me elaborate a little bit on his arguments, though.<div>Geometry optimization is based on energy minimization, which procedes by varying the structural parameters (nuclear coordinates, unit-cell shape/size) using various algorithms, all of which vary the struc parameters along energy derivatives (forces and stress). When the ground state is nondegenerate, energy derivatives have the same symmetry as the the geometry of the system. Energy minimization, therefore, cannot break any symmetry unless: i) random displacements are introduced on purpose (as suggested by Gabriele, and as sometimes done); ii) some noise comes in unporposedly, because of numerical accuracy (this is often coped is, again as suggested by Gabriele, by explicitly simmetrizing the resulting forces), or iii) if the ground state is degenerate, giving rise to Jahn-Teller distortions.</div><div>I do not expect to have been very pedagogic, but hope nevertheless to have offered some food for thoughts.</div><div>Stefano</div><div><br><div><div>On Feb 5, 2009, at 5:38 PM, Gabriele Sclauzero wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite"><div><br>Green Power wrote:<br><blockquote type="cite">Dear PWscf users,<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">I wonder if PWscf can deal with imposed symmetry for structural <br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">relaxation calculations. If so, dose the imposed symmetry speed up the <br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">calculations? Thanks in advance.<br></blockquote><br>The symmetry is determined at the beginning of the run and depends on the bravais lattice, <br>atomic positions and maybe other stuff (like starting magnetization for noncolinear <br>calculations with SO).<br>Everything is symmetrizing with this initial symmetry which holds during all the relaxation.<br>You may want to break symmetry, rather than imposing it, when doing structural relaxations <br>in order not to be confined in a subspace of configurations.<br><br>If you want to impose constraints, well, that's another story...<br><br>GS<br><br><br><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">Tian<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">Georgetown University<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">Washington DC 20057<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">------------------------------------------------------------------------<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">_______________________________________________<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">Pw_forum mailing list<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><a href="mailto:Pw_forum@pwscf.org">Pw_forum@pwscf.org</a><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><a href="http://www.democritos.it/mailman/listinfo/pw_forum">http://www.democritos.it/mailman/listinfo/pw_forum</a><br></blockquote><br>-- <br><br><br>o ------------------------------------------------ o<br>| Gabriele Sclauzero, PhD Student |<br>| c/o: SISSA & CNR-INFM Democritos, |<br>| via Beirut 2-4, 34014 Trieste (Italy) |<br>| email: <a href="mailto:sclauzer@sissa.it">sclauzer@sissa.it</a> |<br>| phone: +39 040 3787 511 |<br>| skype: gurlonotturno |<br>o ------------------------------------------------ o<br>_______________________________________________<br>Pw_forum mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Pw_forum@pwscf.org">Pw_forum@pwscf.org</a><br>http://www.democritos.it/mailman/listinfo/pw_forum<br></div></blockquote></div><br><div apple-content-edited="true"> <span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><font class="Apple-style-span" size="3"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 12px; ">---</span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><font class="Apple-style-span" size="3"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 12px; ">Stefano Baroni - SISSA</span></font><font class="Apple-style-span" size="3"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 12px; "> </span></font><font class="Apple-style-span" size="3"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 12px; ">&</span></font><font class="Apple-style-span" size="3"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 12px; "> </span></font><font class="Apple-style-span" size="3"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 12px; ">DEMOCRITOS National Simulation Center - Trieste</span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><font class="Apple-style-span" size="3"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 12px; "><a href="http://www.sissa.it/~baroni">http://www.sissa.it/~baroni</a> / [+39] 040 3787 406 (tel) -528 (fax) / stefanobaroni (skype)</span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; min-height: 14px; font-size: 12px; "><br style="font-size: 12px; "></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; min-height: 14px; font-size: 12px; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 14px; "><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><font class="Apple-style-span" size="3"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 12px; ">La morale est une logique de l'action comme la logique est une morale de la pensée - Jean Piaget</span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><font class="Apple-style-span" size="3"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 12px; "><br></span></font></div></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><font class="Apple-style-span" size="3"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 12px; ">Please, if possible, don't</span></font><font class="Apple-style-span" size="3"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 12px; "> </span></font><font class="Apple-style-span" size="3"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 12px; ">send me MS Word or PowerPoint attachments</span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><font class="Apple-style-span" size="3"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 12px; ">Why? See:</span></font><font class="Apple-style-span" size="3"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 12px; "> </span></font><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#0023E9" size="3"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 12px; "><a href="http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html">http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html</a></span></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#0023E9" size="3"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 12px; "><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></span></font></div></div></div></span><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"></div></span><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"></div></span><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"></div></span><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"> </div><br></div></body></html>